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TOPIC: Dawn of EU Army.

Dawn of EU Army. 1 week 21 hours ago #2859825

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www.express.co.uk/news/world/878918/eu-a...t-brussels-uk-brexit

DAWN OF EU ARMY:

PUBLISHED: 09:57, Mon, Nov 13, 2017 | UPDATED: 11:26, Mon, Nov 13, 2017

Brussels signs off military plan & hails historic day without UK
BRUSSELS has moved even closer to an EU Army after 23 state signed off on a key military agreement today - a move a high-ranking eurocrat hailed as a "historic day".

Tory MEP blasts Brussels over EU army it has already formed

Germany and France are leading the charge for a new defence union, which aims to cement EU unity after Brexit.

The campaign for a European defence union stretches back to the 1950s, although the movement has stuttered in the decades since.

But EU officials are now celebrating as progress accelerates with the support of Brussels chiefs Jean-Claude Juncker, Guy Verhofstadt and Michel Barnier.

One unnamed official quoted by Reuters news agency said today: “We've never come this far before. We are in a new situation.”

EU foreign and defence ministers signed the new pact at around 10.30am GMT. EU leaders will then officially back it next month to make it EU law.

Federica Mogherini emphasised the importance of today’s agreement this morning.

The EU’s High Representative for Foreign Affairs and Security said: “It’s going to be quite a historic day today for European defence."

The pilot stage will include a system to spot weaknesses across EU armed forces, while a multi-billion-euro fund to support the pact is still under negotiation.

It is just the latest step in the march towards an all-out EU army, with a military headquarters already approved and proposals to purchase military equipment being considered.

Long blocked by Britain, which feared the creation of an EU army, defence integration was revived by France and Germany after last June's Brexit vote.

It follows years of spending cuts that have left European military forces short of vital assets.

Already the majority of EU members do not meet Nato’s defence spending target of 2 per cent, with only Poland, Greece and Estonia budgeting for the amount.

Britain, and the US are the other two nations meeting the target.

EU states are signing a new pact for a joint defence union

Aside from Denmark, which has opted out of all EU defence policies, only Austria, Poland, Ireland and Malta have yet to decide whether to join the pact.

The UK is not part of the initiative but British officials have been pressing for third country involvement. Britain may be able to join in but only on an exceptional basis if it provides substantial funds and expertise.

Speaking before the pact signing, Ms Mogherini praised the proposed European defence union.

She said: “After so many years, finally the provision of the Lisbon Treaty establishing the possibility for EU member states to have a Permeant Structured Cooperation on Defence, today it’s going to be initiated.”

“Today we will definitely launch a new page for European defence and I think this will be the news of the day.”

Federica Mogherini hailed 'a new chapter' for European defence today

She said more than 50 projects were already being proposed by states regarding the new union.

“Member states have presented already more than 50 concrete projects both in the field of capabilities and in the field of operations.

Responding to a question about why an EU Army is needed if NATO already exists, Ms Mogherini said the proposed new defence union offered more flexibility.

She said: “Think of Africa, think of security in Africa. The European Union is more present there than NATO when it comes to training of security forces, when it comes to the delicate link between development and security.

“We are better equipped to act in areas where there is not a purely military action that is needed, but we can also develop more our military capabilities to act to reinforce our strategic autonomy.”

READ MORE: British veterans fury at EU Army
UK veterans are furious British officials are even considering joining an EU Army

The proposals have infuriated British armed force veterans, who say reliance on a joint military would undermine the Brexit vote.
David Banks of Veterans for Britain told Express.co.uk on Friday: "This simply hollows out the powers of the UK government and parliament.
"It would keep us locked in to not being an independent military state. We would have the trappings of independence."

Well Well Well! That was quick! I wonder why. :whistle:
I wonder, why the secrecy.B)
I wonder, what next. Conscription for all member states?

The word dictatorship comes to mind, yet again.
Hopefully, Britain will get OUT of this corrupt club ... A.S.A.P.

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Dawn of EU Army. 1 week 21 hours ago #2859836

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Well many of us, other Europeans don't see it at all as a dictatorship but more at Europeans free at last to build their united Europe the way they like without being vetoed systematically by the UK on their every single project...;)

In the long term this brexit will be a good thing for everyone on both sides..
We will at last all walk our way happily both sides of the chanel...
The following user(s) said Well Said: galty

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Last Edit: by pascalou.

Dawn of EU Army. 1 week 19 hours ago #2859923

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EU won't be short of manpower with all the influx of young, fit men that have been invited to migrate to Europe. Some military training and provision of weapons will see a EU army to be reckoned with.
The following user(s) said Well Said: Annette

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Dawn of EU Army. 1 week 19 hours ago #2859939

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pascalou wrote: Well many of us, other Europeans don't see it at all as a dictatorship but more at Europeans free at last to build their united Europe the way they like without being vetoed systematically by the UK on their every single project...;)

In the long term this brexit will be a good thing for everyone on both sides..
We will at last all walk our way happily both sides of the chanel...


I`ve no interest in those Europeans who don`t see the EU and/or an EU Army as a dictatorship, if they feel "free at last" :laugh: that`s fine, each to their own.

I worry for the millions of Europeans who actually live here in Europe and desperately want to get out of the dictatorship of the EU. :(
I do hope they will find another `strong voice of reason` to veto any of the many undesirable EU plans, when the UK leaves the EU. :-)

I agree with you that in the long term, brexit will be good for Britain. :-)
I was delighted to hear they voted to LEAVE :-).
I, like millions of others, am convinced that the EU would have been their ruin, but leaving the EU will be the very making of Britain. :xxx:

I don`t agree with you that brexit will be a good thing for everyone on both sides, but maybe that is how you perceive it in Asia.
Here in Europe, very many countries are sad that "the voice of reason" = Britain, is leaving the EU, and they wish they could be allowed a referendum to get out, too. :(

I don`t understand what you mean by "We will at last all walk our way happily both sides of the chanel..."
In the UK, and here - mainland Europe, we have all always happily walked our way both sides of the chanel ... well, at least since the end of WW11. ;)
The following user(s) said Well Said: Polliyana

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Dawn of EU Army. 1 week 19 hours ago #2859943

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A United EU army could well indeed be a force to be reckoned with...................but with whom will they be engaged against...........and would a EU Army fire on its own citizens.................German soldiers firing on German citizens?

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Dawn of EU Army. 1 week 18 hours ago #2859972

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paws4thought wrote:

pascalou wrote: Well many of us, other Europeans don't see it at all as a dictatorship but more at Europeans free at last to build their united Europe the way they like without being vetoed systematically by the UK on their every single project...;)

In the long term this brexit will be a good thing for everyone on both sides..
We will at last all walk our way happily both sides of the chanel...


I don`t understand what you mean by "We will at last all walk our way happily both sides of the chanel..."
In the UK, and here - mainland Europe, we have all always happily walked our way both sides of the chanel ... well, at least since the end of WW11. ;)



That referred to the fact that for decades Europeans felt their hands were being tied by the UK who were dragging their feet and very obviously not belonging in the E.U. and vetoing every project .

Now as I said we will all walk our way...B)
I have no doubt that the French, who voted for the E.U by chosing Macron, and the German, Belgium and Italian, agree with Italy premier Minister who said let's use Brexit and Trump America be our strength to move forward and build a stronger E.U with more representations ,voices and diversity for all small nations by giving them the 73 MPs vacant sits left by the Brits.

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Dawn of EU Army. 1 week 17 hours ago #2859999

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pascalou wrote: Well many of us, other Europeans don't see it at all as a dictatorship but more at Europeans free at last to build their united Europe the way they like without being vetoed systematically by the UK on their every single project...;)



I am so pleased that you being French /living on mainland Europe are such a supporter of this latest EU lunacy as it's no coincidence this is being pushed through now that we are leaving and can't veto it , please allow me to explain and indeed remember this post in the years to come and I think even you will eventually see the error of your 'foolish' ways .
The only reason you aren't speaking German today is because of the uk and indeed America Canada Australia ( I could also throw in India and other contributors to the allies in WW2 but you get the picture ) and ever since then an organisation called NATO is THE ONLY THING that has kept you safe ( please don't believe French forces could actually protect 'France' against anything on a military front :)
NATO has America onboard and like it or not its the only military force capable of anything on a large scale .... FACT ...
The reason the EU wants ( and indeed is rushing this through as fast as it can ) is because the eu doesn't have any actual control over NATO but with its own military then it gets ( will call it an army but obviously I include air /sea power too) its own army without any actual cost to the eu budget ( member states pay its military ) and as with everything in the eu it gets it without responsibilities and these will become apparent in the first hostilities and there will be many as I will explain .....
let us imagine country 'A' has a fighting strength ( the actual total manpower to be an effective offensive army ) of 100,000 men but due to NATO as cost cutting is currently running on a skeleton of say 40,000 as we all know there hasn't actually been any 'wars' since WW2 so they've cut back .... so they are 60,000 men short ...
Now Europe has a migrant crisis , the population of Africa is due to double by just 2050 and as seen already ISIS and other 'groups' are rife throughout that continent , throw in corruption unemployment etc and the migrant crisis will hit uncontrollable proportions so in order to halt this the eu needs its own fighting force directly controllable by them and not NATO to send on what they will call 'peace keeping ' missions and these will last years ( see Iraq /Afghanistan /Libya for how long it takes to actually stabilise a country ( if ever !) so the eu will say to member states deploy your peacekeeping forces in countries A B C and D and make them 'peaceful ' so migrants stop heading for Europe !


Now the countries will talk to their military and the first thing they will say is to run a peace keeping force in an African state for just one year alone I will need 'X ' amount of men and £££££ .... but I only have 40,000 men trained and now that we aren't any longer our national army but a European army recruitment has already slowed to a trickle ..... so it's conscription time but the elitist Eurocrats won't want THEIR children being drafted so some kind of level must be found ( all those not in university ???) for these conscripts ... and believe me when I add that a conscription army as a fighting force is in reality 'useless' .... cannon fodder and the eu conscripts will take many many casualties as they aren't real proffesional soldiers but simply kids making the numbers up /easy targets :) laugh all you wish pasc but rest assured within a very very short space of time you will see I am correct and we will then see how the French enjoy the lunacy of the EU you forever tell us about when French conscripts are fighting in some African state 'forever' .... what do I think ? Personally I too welcome Junkers army as I think in reality Europeans actually deserve it as you've all blindly accepted the EU so now with the uk and it's steadying opinion on everything you are free and welcome to your home grown 'fate' ..... obviously the uk won't be part of this folly as we will stay with NATO :)

In the long term this brexit will be a good thing for everyone on both sides..
We will at last all walk our way happily both sides of the chanel...

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Last Edit: by marmadukee.

Dawn of EU Army. 1 week 17 hours ago #2860013

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Just had a quick look on YouTube and there's lots to choose from but here is one at random


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Dawn of EU Army. 1 week 17 hours ago #2860029

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And as for an eu army being a protective force ? :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:








A smoke screen by Junkers simply to put 'peace keepers ' into African nations ..... just wait and see , but for the time being we're all being told it's a great idea ...... let's see how long this happiness lasts (lol )

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Dawn of EU Army. 1 week 17 hours ago #2860037

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I wonder how this will work in practise. Combining the military disciplines of the various factions of the EU is going to create chaos. Will there be an equal number of soldiers from each country, or will one nation dominate? Which country will train them, which discipline will be used? During the last war, none of the European countries were strong enough to defeat the Germans. Like it or not, there are national characteristics. Some nations are more disciplined than others, which is why the Germans were so successful in the last war.

One of the main reasons why many of us voted to leave the EU is because it's a shambles.

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